Rosenverse

Log in or create a free Rosenverse account to watch this video.

Log in Create free account

100s of community videos are available to free members. Conference talks are generally available to Gold members.

Fireside chat with Sarah Brooks and Jen Pahlka

Thursday, October 21, 2021 • Civic Design Community
Share the love for this talk
Fireside chat with Sarah Brooks and Jen Pahlka
Speakers: Sarah Brooks and Jennifer Pahlka
Link:

Summary

For our second gathering of the Civic Design Community, we’ll learn from Jennifer Pahlka, founder and former Executive Director of Code for America who served. as US Deputy Chief Technology Officer from June 2013 to June 2014 and helped found the United States Digital Service. We’ll explore the importance of designers inside and outside government moving upstream to work alongside policymakers to make alliances and push back when needed to strengthen conditions for designers and digital technologists to do work that delivers improved outcomes for residents and citizens.

Key Insights

  • Civic Tech work is not just implementation; it must influence policymaking for real impact.

  • The Boston school selection project revealed how policy assumptions (e.g., walking distance) need revising based on implementation feedback.

  • Traditional government projects often lack timely feedback loops between policy writers and implementers, leading to failures.

  • Healthcare.gov’s failure catalyzed the creation of the U.S. Digital Service and a new model focused on agile, collaborative development.

  • Long-term embedding of designers and technologists in government enables deeper learning and more effective change.

  • Many career public servants do user research unofficially but need permission and training to do it effectively.

  • Low trust in government systems causes users, such as doctors interacting with CMS portals, to feel frustrated and opt out.

  • Successful Civic Tech requires partnerships that blend technology, policy, and frontline user understanding.

  • Private sector frameworks like Customer Experience (CX) may not fully apply to public services without adaptation.

  • Community support and strong relationships are essential for sustaining Civic Tech efforts within challenging government environments.

Notable Quotes

"I was largely wrong about how we thought technology and design would just implement policy."

"People implementing policy see the problems with the policy long before anyone else does."

"The policy was about walking distance as the crow flies, but that wasn’t walkable—so the policy needed to change."

"In traditional government projects, policy writers are often gone long before implementations fail or need revising."

"Healthcare.gov was a blow, but it opened the door to new ways to work in government technology."

"If leaders tell me to build a concrete boat, I will build a concrete boat—and that’s damaging to government."

"Designing a service is really designing a new relationship between government and people, who come with enormous baggage."

"User research in government is often done without knowing what it’s called, and people aren’t always empowered to do it."

"We need to push back when we see the concrete boat coming, but it’s really hard to know how."

"Community and ‘the phone a friend’ are what get you through the hardest parts of working in government."

Ask the Rosenbot
Courtney Maya George
Scale Your Organization and Grow Your Designers
2022 • DesignOps Summit 2022
Gold
Mark Templeton
Creating a Legacy: the ultimate experience
2017 • Enterprise Experience 2017
Gold
Holly Cole
Understanding Experiences: When you have to do more than work
2018 • DesignOps Summit 2018
Gold
Chris Geison
Theme Two Intro
2023 • Advancing Research 2023
Gold
Christian Bason
Expand—Rethinking Design for Public Challenges
2022 • Civic Design Community
Erin May
Distributed, Democratized, Decentralized: Finding a Research Model to Support Your Org
2022 • Advancing Research 2022
Gold
Patrick Commarford
Design Staffing for Impact
2024 • DesignOps Summit 2020
Gold
Sam Proulx
Online Shopping: Designing an Accessible Experience
2023 • Design in Product 2023
Gold
Savannah Carlin
Don't botch the bot: Designing interactions for AI
2024 • Designing with AI 2024
Gold
Soma Ghosh
What emerging methods are advancing UX research [Advancing Research Community Workshop Series]
2023 • Advancing Research Community
Kaitlin Tasker
Fast and Fearless Inclusive Research
2023 • Advancing Research 2023
Gold
Dane DeSutter
What co-speech gestures reveal about users’ thinking during interviews
2023 • Rosenfeld Community
Smitha Papolu
Theme 3 Discussion
2024 • Enterprise Experience 2020
Gold
Dawn Ressel
Full-Stack User Experiences: A Marriage of Design and Technology
2016 • Enterprise UX 2016
Gold
Kate Towsey
Participant Recruitment and Management Tools
2026 • Advancing Research 2026
Conference
Samuel Martin
Co-Design vs Faux-Design: Navigating the Complexities of Sharing Power in Co-Design
2026 • Rosenfeld Community

More Videos

Daniel Gloyd

"Hugh Dubberly argues we should stop describing design as problem solving and instead see it as engaged conversation."

Daniel Gloyd

Designing From the Inside Out: How Method Acting Can Inspire Design Research

February 12, 2026

Deirdre Hirschtritt

"We’re not probing for interesting anecdotes or seating quotes for a slide deck. We’re answering real questions to provide actionable guidance."

Deirdre Hirschtritt Cesar Paredes Marie Perrot

Research is Only as Good as the Relationships You Build

November 17, 2022

Benjamin Real

"It was like giving a map that you could not read or even understand."

Benjamin Real

Maturity Models: A Core Tool for Creating a DesignOps Strategy

October 1, 2021

Max Gadney

"I always see interviews as a two-way conversation where I’m interviewing them as much as they’re interviewing me."

Max Gadney Andrea Petrucci Joshua Stehr Hannah Wickes

Assessing UX jobs for impact in climate

August 14, 2024

Lada Gorlenko

"Leading change in a century-old company is a very different challenge."

Lada Gorlenko

Theme 1: Intro

January 8, 2024

Feyikemi Akinwolemiwa

"The most expensive part of digital initiative is not delivery, it’s that messy middle—the space between insights and moving things forward."

Feyikemi Akinwolemiwa

Play to innovate: How curiosity and experimentation transform UX

March 11, 2026

Bria Alexander

"Please be sure to make sure you change your conference itinerary to your local time zone."

Bria Alexander

Opening Remarks

March 29, 2023

Llewyn Paine

"If you can’t see a human in a video, how do you know the entire conversation wasn’t fabricated?"

Llewyn Paine

[Demo] Deploying AI doppelgangers to de-identify user research recordings

June 5, 2024

Bria Alexander

"An OKR coach told us to think of OKRs like a health panel at a physical—you have KPIs for status and OKRs for change targets."

Bria Alexander Benson Low Natalya Pemberton Stephanie Goldthorpe

OKRs—Helpful or Harmful?

January 20, 2022